Transform your photos into one-of-a-kind, hand painted masterpieces!

 
Return to Main Discussion Page

Discussion

Main Menu | Search Discussions

Search Discussions

 
 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

"knowledge Of The Hidden" Art

The occult (from the Latin word occultus "clandestine, hidden, secret") is "knowledge of the hidden" or "knowledge of the paranormal", as opposed to facts and "knowledge of the measurable", usually referred to as science.

ART related to the topic in the subject heading presented in the form of a video focusing on 3 paintings that were made today and part of a larger series of 11 paintings.

When I first started this path of discovery it was the result of "curiosity" surrounding the painting techniques of Jackson Pollock, this thread is not about that. this thread is about what followed.

Not a lot of room for words when one is trying to explain something NEW and DIFFERENT and of unknown origin. I have a whole lot of mixed feelings about this, in particularly what I see in the paintings or rather what appears to me. I say to me because it might not appear to you, but that is the question I am most interested in for discussion but more so to collaborate what I see.

What do you see? What do you see? What do you see?

I'll say this I looked at these paintings for hours on end and from many different angels and in different light, I also looked through the lens of my camera as well and further looked at the paintings at different magnifications on my computer screen and I'll say that at different levels and different angles I see different apparitions, many hundreds in total, possibly thousands if counted.

I won't tell you just yet what I see and how I'm inclined to interpret it because I don't want to taint your perception with my view. If you start to see a pattern or theme you might want to take the time to view all the videos in this series which were a compilation of over 500 photos I took of the paintings now 11 in total. They are on my youtube channel or you can see them in the links posted in the Jackson Pollock thread which I closed.

No brushes or tools were used to touch the canvas with the paint, the paint was dripped and splattered for all the paintings.

Reply Order

Post Reply
 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

You may not want to view any of these videos and I perfectly understand, it's not an easy subject to contemplate, the unknown in this realm can be very scary to confront and I say this from experience.

 

Lisa Kaiser

11 Days Ago

I see entities, very cool!

They are your paranormal children...little monsters, but beloved little giants in the world of Etherland.

 

David Bridburg

11 Days Ago

Mario,

The music reminds me of my trips on UFOs.

It seems to be a good time.

This is one more show where I wont be turning in a report.

Dave

 

Lisa Kaiser

11 Days Ago

I love the music, way to go!!

 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

Thank you Lisa, I'm pretty mentally exhausted after this CrAzY series of events transpired and brought me to this point.

Well David I understand,what could the report possibly say to this reality unless one is telling it from the first person based on actual physical observance? My inquiry is mostly on the level of wanting to know who "see's" things and what and who doesn't see anything if that is even possible.

David,speaking of UfO's I felt like Richard Dreyfuss in the movie Close Encounters Of The Third Kind during this "episode". :-)

 

David Bridburg

11 Days Ago

I used to see things in such art.

I no longer see anything.

I used to write reports on this sort of art. In the middle of such a job, I realized I am just seeing some aspect of myself. That was why such art was radical at first, but the general public now more often sees beautiful patterns in the work as opposed to other aspects of their lives.

To finish the answer, it is possible to weed out yourself from the patterns.

Dave

 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

I wish that were entirely true David, that it's simply a reflection of sorts of the artist, if that is what your implying? the reason is that none of the forms which appear were conceived or planned. Something else is at play, what exactly to call it?

 

David Bridburg

11 Days Ago

Technique is at play.

First you apply the technique, then you apply the visions or projection of feelings and ideas.

If you lose some track of what order that is in, it would seem like you were painting and seeing at the same time.

Dave

 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

Yes, but how do you spatter and drip paint and have 11 paintings with thousand of recurring forms following a certain unplanned theme or event being depicted? Is it what I was thinking consciously or was it the unconscious or was it something else, why don't I see BBQ and bacon?

 

David, This is interesting what you said: '...First you apply the technique, then you apply the visions or projection of feelings and ideas. ...'; and I did give it some thought. Yet...I might wish it to be that simple; but in reality it is not really a linear process - even the 'time' aspects and pageantry of images follow no linear reason. I agree that a person could weed out the personal - and more times than not people do weed out the like; often replacing it with more collective and kind approximations. I accept what arrives (like it or not). But that is me; and that is something I proved to myself - much written about it too.

Personally (and Mario knows my feeling on the subject), I am less concerned with the immediate, familiar, forms that might fix to the image ( I take it for granted); and even on completion I often am still in wonder as to what the image has to suggest (and when it comes to a large oil painting, using sometimes classical techniques that require weeks (months) between layers - that means I am living with an image and not directly demanding anything more than to feel it arriving at its best possible approach to being reconciled.)(what it is comes over time; and grows beyond what it was...always suggesting something un-thought of and new.)

[put an image up 6jan19 from 1985, a drawing, 'Exemplar in a Second Look' (but it started to be 'an' image approximately a year earlier) - put a big-long-description about the process; if you are interested]

 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

Terrance, what is interesting is that in viewing your Comstock series some of the images are very familiar and similar to what I see in my paintings. Pregnancy of sorts, things darting out of entity's mouths and also a lot of face to face conflicts going on, very social realm.

More importantly I think I have a good grasp on what this series of mine is depicting, again I say I think never being certain. I have run out of paint and canvas for the third time and I feel fine saying this particular series stands good at 11. Did I mention some time ago I was seeing 1111 everywhere, every time I looked and my watch or the microwave clock, it would be at 1111. For another thread I guess. :-)

 

David Bridburg

11 Days Ago

Conscience or subconscious? What forms the pattern?

There are things to technique that are common patterns.

Here is a for instance coming from water flow in nature. The top image looks a bit like how a leaf is formed.

http://news.mit.edu/2012/river-networks-mathematics-1205

Dave

 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

That's an interesting theory David, seems like nature likes to mimic nature.

So basically you are suggesting there is no unknown or hidden knowledge?

That being the fact it would stand to reason that each of these paintings could be easily duplicated by following technique?

I challenge anyone to try, that would prove the theory and make it science.

I'm more inclined to believe in "mind being fluid" and that it has more of an effect than external forces of nature in this creative process but how?

 

David Bridburg

11 Days Ago

fibonacci numbers

Mario,

It is not a matter of duplicating things. It is a matter of how nature breaks out. Things come out in patterns.

Dave

Also the Murdoch equations. A young woman at MIT a few years ago created a new set of equations on crystalline structures that were predictive.

 

David, perhaps we need to also remember that where mathematics might well provide for a 'pattern' of predictability to be located to a 'material' or to 'materiality'; no math has of yet - or I will dare might ever - lay claim to the 'predictability' of a Human individual.

Duplication or predictability are not options for an individual 'entity' - and a creative image fits the bill of an entity, when more than materiality is applied to its enjoyment by a Mind. If I 'reduce' my appreciation of creative image below such threshold, I might better pass my days in some other activity - but that is only my personal observation; another mind will find its threshold and that is how it always might be.

perhaps a mind forms the pattern - whatever mind really is found to be?

 

David Bridburg

11 Days Ago

TDP,

Actually you can look up forms of language across the globe as human behavior and see patterns of predictability for individuals.

This also goes for some aspects and outcomes for research done by individual human beings.

This goes for individual decision makers when it comes to economics as well.

This goes for patient treatment programs in hospitals as well, diagnosis to prognosis. Even mistakes at hospitals and the mortality rates.

edit with big data that list is only scratching the surface of how we see group to individual patterns and individual to group patterns.

edit 2 then there is the insurance industry........the banking industry, the credit card industry, the marketing industry..........


Dave

 

Thank you Dave; yet -as predictable - once again we each are approaching the issue from different sides of a coin. You from the 'heads', I from the 'tails' - and if you look closely the metaphors are very much in line with all thus far stated. Is there a paradox (smallest perhaps) at your end of the metaphor? I am not seeing it.

From my side of the coinage there is a hefty dose of paradox and that leads me to believe: that in the firmament of my 'tails' position something quite worthy is to be found - and before you might laugh, I might suggest you scrutinize all that we have come to realize about the symbology of 'firmament' (I posted some good reference sources over the past month; I even believe you might have noted them).

Your points mentioned, in no way reflect that other side of the coin; I can appreciate your inform, from other perceptiveness but you still have not been able to capture the implications of this other side. My shit stink, to be sure, but it is not its 'end' of purposiveness; it is only its half-way-point to fully fulfill itself - all else is what I chose to do with it. [I much appreciate that your post helped me remember and re-clarify that 'ample' paradox-of-metaphor; thank you]

 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

You guys get very deep into this, I only asked what do you see and how would you go by explaining it, I am asking for your view on any number of the forms,apparitions,entities in the video or videos I referenced in hope of getting a pragmatic opinion or even a conclusion. Sometimes the easiest answers are the most profound. I used to watch William F. Buckley Jr. years ago for the hard answers. :-)

David answered he see's nothing anymore, must be looking with eyes closed or decided beforehand there is nothing to see and therefore see's nothing? yet before he stated that it was radical what he saw, what changed, the image or the idea of the image's origin in the realm of possibility?

 

David Bridburg

11 Days Ago

TDP,

We are in agreement......because you used the concept of paradox. Why? Because between the ends, as you put it, is the human mind. Neither of us can explain this stuff to moon rocks.

Dave

 

David Bridburg

11 Days Ago

Mario,

I see what you painted.

Dave

 

Mario Carta

11 Days Ago

And what is that? Lets start with the video thumbnail, what do you see?

You can stop the video at 28 seconds and go full screen on the image.

 

Ronald Walker

10 Days Ago

Interesting, I see stuff like demons, animals, skulls. I feel that people will always try to see images in stuff because it is tied into survival. The search for food coincides with not becoming food. If the brain satisfies itself there is nothing to benefit survival one way or the other then the image is relegated to simply being a pleasant design. The power of these works is I don't think one would ever reach the ultimate conclusion that there are no creatures lying in wait, or hiding.

 

Mario Carta

10 Days Ago

Thank you Ronald and I also see what you see in the painting and much more but that's only because I have them to see up close and in person. I do understand that's what anthropology says but we have also evolved and I usually stay pretty satisfied so finding food is just around the corner or the fridge.I also can't remember the last time I had to worry about being food for someone else.

I just think our universe is only as big as we can imagine it and if it's that big who knows how many other realms exist waiting to be discovered some right here before our eyes?

 

Robert Kernodle

10 Days Ago


“Look at walls splashed with a number of stains, or stones of various mixed colours. If you have to invent some scene, you can see there resemblances to a number of landscapes, adorned with mountains, rivers, rocks, trees, great plains, valleys and hills, in various ways. Also you can see various battles, and lively postures of strange figures, expressions on faces, costumes and an infinite number of things, which you can reduce to good integrated form. This happens on such walls and varicoloured stones, (which act) like the sound of bells, in whose peeling you can find every name and word that you can imagine.

Do not despise my opinion, when I remind you that it should not be hard for you to stop sometimes and look into the stains of walls, or the ashes of a fire, or clouds, or mud or like places, in which, if you consider them well, you may find really marvelous ideas. The mind of the painter is stimulated to new discoveries, the composition of battles of animals and men, various compositions of landscapes and monstrous things, such as devils and similar things, which may bring you honor, because by indistinct things the mind is stimulated to new inventions.”
― Leonardo da Vinci

You are learning what da Vinci, and probably a number of others (including moi) discovered independently, namely that all the forms of all the universe exist simultaneously in one grand flow, from which any one of them can emerge to become more refined.

The foundations for the forms of individual figures in the following multimedia work of mine came from my bathtub, where, over a period of weeks, I observed, selected, and excavated with clear tape, dozens of random hair formations that I found particularly interesting, later fattening them up as alien letters or musical notes (as I came to think of them):

Robert Kernodle Photography Prints

Big Skip

This is a very popular discussion with 107 responses.   In order to help the page load faster and allow you to quickly read the most recent posts, we're only showing you the oldest 25 posts and the newest 25 posts.   Everything in the middle has been skipped.   Want to read the entire discussion?   No problem: click here.

 

Mario Carta

10 Days Ago

Robert "namely that all the forms of all the universe exist simultaneously in one grand flow, from which any one of them can emerge to become more refined."

Interesting

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

"There is no answer, ... only more questions, ... and more experiencing in the realm of human perception. ... Images AND words are vehicles for exploring these questions endlessly.

You know, "... the journey".


That could very well be the case for us mortals Robert, totally agree it's a journey .

As Uther stated, Fun fun fun....and it can also get pretty weird at times when certain types of apparitions manifest, sometimes they will make you want to keep your eyes open while you shower and wash your hair. :-)

 

Robert Kernodle

7 Days Ago

Don't forget, though, that, even in the shower, those apparitions appear too, ... right under your feet, as fallen hairs that follow the paths of water currents going down the drain.

Remember my Alien Symphony.

There's no escape!

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

Hahaha Robert, I have an onxy stone floor in my bathroom and I have eyes looking up my towel every day of my life.

 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

They are everywhere... they are even coming out of your walls......






They're everywhere......



 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

You really can't trust what you see....

You can make money with this one... both table tops are EXACTLY the same rectangle.... go ahead... get out a ruler..


 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

There are NO curves in this image.. again.. go get your straight edge.. ;O) oh look another face that isn't a face


 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

If you haven't seen this one before, then you may take you awhile to see the "hidden" image.. but once you do, you cannot "unsee" it.




 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

Simply put we are here because our ancestors survived long enough to procreate.

One of the things the mammalian brain is good at is automating things that are routine... like breathing, or contracting you heart muscle. Another is recognizing faces...there is a dedicated area of the brain for doing just that... it is automatic.. you cannot not have your brain "search" for faces. It is so specialized that it searches for a full face, a 3/4 face and a side view face. [ that is why your brain likes those Picasso paintings with eyes on one side of the face. ]

how many can you find?


 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

Bob those are great optical illusions "more of a brain" response of some sort, however I think the apparitions of forms and recurring forms for that matter with some semblance of a theme underlying it makes me think this is much,much more than that.

Let me ask you, what do you "see" in that thumbnail of the video I posted at 22hrs.?

 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

Well in the dead center is a purple Gumby... in the far center left there is a little red faced guy peaking out of the background.... there are other faces and partial faces here and there. Looking again I can see that purple Gumby is now a big purple penis... you know there had to be one in there somewhere.. ;O)

That's about it.

 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

The themes are created by your brain translating what you see into what you have seen in the past along with what you have been thinking about, hearing about, reading about, along with your past cultural associations, and of course..... THE BIBLE.... ;O)

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

Lol! Thanks Bob, you always manage to give me a good laugh. :-)

Btw, and we know where your mind has been. Lol!

 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

;O)

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

:-)

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

And now back to a more serious note.

Here is a quote which I found in the end notes of the most interesting book which was gifted to me by our own Terrance J. DePietro titled "Prologue To The Nature That Loves To Hide"

in his end notes Terrance quotes a passage from another book titled "The Forms Of Things Unknown" by Sir Herbert Read and here is a partial quote of that quote which caught my eye.The quote frames the activity in a way which I can relate to and seems very plausible.

However it's just another perspective from someone who has obviously given this much deeper thought than I can claim but which seeks to explain and provide more insight to this phenomena. ( When it was written in 1963 by the Author I was 3 years old. )

Excerpt from that quote:

"I could quote many other statements made by artists themselves which show they are always aware, if they reflect on their creative experience , that they are using a language which has nothing to do with literary language, the language of concepts, but which in it's own way, can express the profoundest truths about reality, truths that are not readily expressed in concepts. If we ask what the artist is trying to do we can reply with Fiedler that he is trying to achieve clarity of consciousness."

"Artistic activity begins when man finds himself face to face with the visible world as something immensely enigmatical: when, driven by an inner necessity and applying the powers of his mind, he grapples with the twisted mass of the visible which presses in upon him and gives it creative form. In the creation of art, man engages in a struggle with nature not for his physical but for his mental existence.....the beginning and the end of artistic activity reside in the creation of forms which only attain existence."

"What art creates is no second world alongside the other world which has an existence without art; what art creates is the world, made by and for the artistic consciousness Art creates the form for that which does not yet exist for the human mind and for which it contrives to create forms on behalf of the human mind. Art does not start from abstract thought in order to arrive at forms; rather, it climbs from the formless to the formed, and in the process its entire mental meaning." 'In the artist's mind a peculiar consciousness of the world is in process of development'

Full quote: "The Forms of Things Unknown', Sir Herbert Read, Meridian Books,1963,pp41-42)

 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

I read the quote... 2 times... and cannot find anything in it that I can relate to reality.

OK... a challenge Mario... please put that quote into words that are more concrete and relatable. Include examples. LOL

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

As is with the art the artist is trying to communicate or understand himself, the language we speak falls short. I read Terrance's book a while back and the first time interesting as it was I was not close to really relating with was was being communicated through the written word.

It was not until by providence that I was moved to paint in this method that upon a second read and further bits of research from other material that Terrance provide me that I began to get a glimpse of what the writings were suggesting. Robert K. has his own take on this as well and he defines his process and philosophy on this subject for even more contemplation.

Terrance kept saying that the experience is very intimate and quite honestly I did not really know what he meant by that, I think I am closer to understanding what he meant but only after fully immersing myself in some 15 paintings I did in which I now have the pleasure of exploring and discovering.

In my own words Bob, "you must begin with the art, through the art, understanding, by what is created or allowed to form, we get a glimpse of and are allowed to discover more than through the concepts and language of words we struggle to derive meaning from, the visual image itself seems to communicate or provide clues. It's rather quite fascinating,magical and almost unbelievable when it happens.

 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

Mario.. what you are describing I would interpret that you are talking about creating art purely for one's self.

I can see how the abstract artist puts themselves into their art and gets back "something" from the creation process. But to expect someone else to get the same "thing" from viewing the resulting work is asking too much. But I can see how some viewers can "see" something in the artist's work, but that "seeing" is of their own creation.. each viewer can "see" something unique themselves... or see nothing but squiggles on canvas.

The non-abstract artist can purposefully create or "hide" meaning in their work... but it is "usually" via metaphor or symbolism that the general public has access to...things like sadness, joy, triumph, etc can be purposely "communicated" by the artist via color and form, or certain objects with inherent symbolic meaning.

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

I would respectfully disagree Bob, yes, I create art for myself but that art may speak it's visual message, meaning,beauty,horror or what ever else the art manifests it'self to be,the art has a life of it's own. Further we are made of the same common elements of life we share with the universe and everything in it so the possibility for recognizing,understanding and communicating is infinite.

 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

Well sure.. a series of random splotches and lines can create patterns that the human brain will "see" faces for example are a given. Certain colors hold common metaphors like happy, sad, danger, good and evil. So yea. But that is still random and coincidental. Unless you are deliberately placing paint to canvas to communicate a certain message.

But when the brain looks around at chaos, like clouds in the sky, or tree bark, or toast it tries to find patterns to sort and interpret.. that is what the brain does. When is " sees " a pattern of 3 spots forming an upside down triangle with some sort of horizontal line under them, it thinks.. that just might be a face.. now is that the face of an enemy or friend, or a lion or just a cat. Or something really bad like a mother-in-law... or someone you owe money to.

If you have someone close their eyes and put an object in their line of sight.. when they open their eyes what is presented to them on their retina is sent to 46 different areas of the brain for processing. Priority is to first establish if it something to fear that will trigger the fight or flight reflex, then there is the processing to see if it is something that it can... let's just say procreate with..., or is it something it can eat, or something to avoid, or ultimately just something it can ignore all together. Then if it is something that it has never seen before that becomes something special to investigate... that is the thing that art is good at.

But all that happens in a split second, but the brain is ALWAYS scanning for patterns to interpret. That is why we get so excited when we suddenly "something" hidden.. Ah ha.. I found it!

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

I believe there is much more to it than can be explained and grasped alone by the language we are speaking, it's the art that speaks, how,why,when, what, and all that, I don't really know, but it "does" or" is".

Now I must go and be with my awaiting lunch which is calling me from the stove top. :-)

 

Bob Galka

7 Days Ago

Well just don't look too closely at your lunch.. no telling what you might see. LOL

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

Oh, but Bob, I must SEE and SMELL first, this is what entices me to TASTE. :-)

 

Robert Kernodle

6 Days Ago

Mario,

Years ago, in 2007 specifically, I entered into my written art journal a long series of passages about what I considered to be the basics of human consciousness. The website where I published those passages has long gone out of business, but, lo and behold, it is archived on the internet ... here:

http://www.oocities.org/eldonrek/omicrondiary.html

I used to keep a written art journal in my prime years -- I think it amounted to over two thousand hand-written pages in spiral notebooks -- I still have them, stored for years and years now, in an old leaky shed in my backyard, buried in there somewhere.

The whole art experience was a grand awakening for me, whose exact beginning conscious moment I knew about and recorded in writing, and whose subsequent development I religiously wrote about all those years.

 

Mario Carta

5 Days Ago

That is pretty cool Robert, read the first page, will get to rest soon.

 

Robert Kernodle

5 Days Ago

When you get bored with that, you might check out this rendition of my experiences:

https://www.redbubble.com/people/robertkernodle/journal/6813708-the-philosophy-of-fluidism-fluid-dynamics-art

I forgot about my journal entries over there.

As I said, I used to eat, breathe, and sleep this stuff. I have written lots of words about it in different forums, and each rewording seems to capture something a little different.

 

Mario Carta

5 Days Ago

Robert, let me ask you and has your views on this subject changed and or evolved over time now that you look back? If so in what ways? it's curiosity asking.

 

Post Reply

Please login before posting a reply to this message.   If you do not have an account on Pixels, click here to create one!

Username

Password